Regular updates (March 18)

[jorgeorpinel]

• Address dvc: update cmd output strings to match docs dvc#3471 (review)
• Misc stuff

[jorgeorpinel]

From 635d6e9#r37945264

cmder is an integrated environment ... we also recommend Git Bash above and Anaconda prompt above

Hi, sorry for the delay here @shcheklein. I tried Cmder and didn't love it. It's kind of complicated and not easy to configure. I'm not sure what you mean by an integrated environment or why that would be desirable. To me, the closest to a simple terminal app that can serve as a true Linux console is ideal, and that's what Windows Terminal does (using WSL). It also supports regular cmd and PowerShell.

looks a bit messy now

I agree it's not super clear but is it because of this change? We were already recommending the other 2 before. We're not really recommending them, just mentioning them because they're well known. Maybe we should rec WT first, and then just mention other interesting options (I can re-include Cmder in that list)?

[shcheklein]

To me, the closest to a simple terminal app that can serve as a true Linux console is ideal, and that's what Windows Terminal does (using WSL).

WSL could be slow. sometimes very slow. When we recommend an environment we need to ask data scientists/ML folks what they prefer. All of them have very specific needs, e.g. they should be able to install conda, pandas, numpy, etc .... they need access to GPU ... they crunch a lot of files. I'm just not sure if WSL is a good option. Cmder was recommended in the DS community since conda can be installed (or even comes with it) and other features.

[shcheklein]

what does "recent" mean?

[jorgeorpinel]

Good question. I'm not sure what's the oldest version this works on, probably its safe to recommend 10+ cc @iAdramelk ?

[jorgeorpinel]

Its easier to revert to "latest" but will always work? We can't guarantee it, maybe we should get specific. But up to you, no strong opinion from my part.

[shcheklein]

yes, I would just specify explicitly the versions we support

[jorgeorpinel]

This is info. I don't currently know exactly. I know the std. node provided by apt-get (Ubuntu) is really old so I had to install like this. @iAdramelk could you chime in here please?

[shcheklein]

we have engines specified as

  "engines": {
    "node": "^12.0.0"
  },

in blog (which will be part of the dvc.org soon). @fabiosantoscode and @iAdramelk should have more context - ping them in Slack if needed

[jorgeorpinel]

Pinged Fabian but he's probably offline rn. I'm using 12 for now so we can merge this and I can update with whatever they say in another PR later. Going to focus on other doc PRs for now.

[shcheklein]

Check this link for example - https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=windows10-okt-wsl&num=2

CmdEr has an option to install it with Git (so you don't need GitBash, Git, etc) - you have shell and git with it - that's why it can be considered a bit more than just terminal.

With Windows Terminal you either have to go with WSL (might be slow for DVC) or you have to install Git Bash and at this point it's not clear what experience is easier - WT or Cmder ... Also I would check how easy it is to install conda, if tqdm is compatible with win terminal (running git bash) ... etc

[jorgeorpinel]

Cmder was recommended in the DS community since conda can be installed
CmdEr has an option to install it with Git

True, the full version comes with Git and SSH built-in but only when running some of the 9 tasks it comes with, I think. Again, not a very easy config:

[jorgeorpinel]

With Windows Terminal you either have to go with WSL (might be slow for DVC) or you have to install Git Bash

I think Git Bash is a stand alone terminal-like app as well, not something you can run from within other terminals. But it's a good argument: no point using WT with cmd or PowerShell if what we're looking for is a POSIX-like experience... You'd have to install cygwin or something like that.

OK I'm convinced. I'll add Cmder back. Should I mention WT at all?

[shcheklein]

@jorgeorpinel so, WT with WSL is a reasonable approach, we can and we should recommend both of them ... I more worried about use recommending git bash as well above ... and even more that we do it in two different paragraphs ... can we combine all of this somehow - and recommend all three options for example?

[jorgeorpinel]

• Just pending a definitive answer in Regular updates (March 18) #1072 (comment) which can be addressed in a later PR. Thanks!