Improvements for XMPP server recommendations

[contrapunctus-1]

As someone trying out XMPP (via Conversations) for the first time after seeing Prism Break's recommendations, I was under the mistaken impression that all XMPP services are created equal. dukgo.com, as I found out the hard way, is among the worst in terms of feature support. This either causes users to write off XMPP (or, in case of tech-illiterate users - such as the friends and family members I invited to use it - the client application itself) as crap, or causes them as well as their contacts to suffer inconvenience as they migrate to new servers.

I suggest that we remove the dukgo.com recommendation, suggest a few top recommendations from this link, as well as provide this link itself -
https://gultsch.de/compliance_ranked.html

[strugee]

👍 for removing dukgo.com. I think this probably would be best in the IM notes section? Though that's a bit overloaded already...

[strixaluco]

I'm definitely pro removing dukgo.com. The recommendation is pretty misleading given the fact that the server is poor in features.

[contrapunctus-1]

@strugee - as far as de-overloading the IM section goes -

• I believe the OTR description could be safely removed (notwithstanding the next point)
• AFAICT OTR is a legacy protocol, and any recommendations based on it should be removed
• Xabber seems set to go - Remove Xabber? #1659
• ChatSecure should be removed from the Android section, as it's iOS-only now, as should the corresponding notes (the guide link could perhaps be replaced with https://medium.com/@mathiasrenner/setup-whatsapp-like-chat-messaging-with-open-source-software-complete-guide-ec7adc0d3519#.7vde30gal instead?)
• I'm not sure why notes on Pidgin exist in the Android IM section, as it is neither available for Android nor recommended in the Android section
• SMS applications (Silence) should be given a separate section, as they are not (AFAIU) used in the same way as IM applications

(along with explaining that Conversations is an XMPP client and requires an account with an XMPP server, it may help to mention that "you can also use your XMPP account to chat using desktop XMPP clients, e.g. Gajim")

[JeremyRand]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 contrapunctus-1:

- SMS applications (Silence) should be given a separate section, as they are not (AFAIU) used in the same way as IM applications

FWIW I use XMPP as an SMS substitute. Not certain how common this is, but I think it's probably a good security practice regardless of commonness.

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[strugee]

Marking as accepting PRs. I'd love to get PRs that remove dukgo.com or implement suggestions in #1688 (comment), with the exception of the remark about "SMS applications":

SMS applications (Silence) should be given a separate section, as they are not (AFAIU) used in the same way as IM applications

I've said this before and I'll say it again: SMS is mostly the same as IM. They're basically the same medium - see #1267 (comment) for an explanation of what I mean by this. They're mostly used in the same way as far as I've seen. I don't see a reason for these to have a separate section, but if you feel strongly about it, please open up a separate issue.

[mimi89999]

@strugee I will make a PR removing dukgo.com.

As for recommending servers, we need to check privacy policies.

[Atavic]

Most of them have no privacy policies. Also, some may raise some doubts:

conversations.im has a trial XMPP account for 6 months only.
jabber.rwth-aachen.de is a german university hosted service.
mail.de is a commercial project.
high-way.me is a forum with some commercial offers.

[hasufell]

jabber.rwth-aachen.de is a german university hosted service.

curious why you consider that a problem

[Atavic]

I see the name of the university, not any mantainer. Maybe @mathiasertl knows more?

[mathiasertl]

jabber.rwth-aachen.de is maintained by @debalance, who is also the maintainer of the mainline Debian package for ejabberd.

I should note that jabber.at also runs at a university, if that is a problem for you (for whatever reason). The University is however just the provider, it's run by the students union (of which I'm a member).

[mathiasertl]

After looking at https://prism-break.org/en/protocols/xmpp/, let me add, content wise:

• We have a list of clients here.
• I recommend removing Thunderbird. It doesn't support SRV records, causing problems for many larger servers.

[debalance]

Please note that while jabber.rwth-aachen.de is (currently) fully compliant, only people with a working e-mail address from one of the universities in Aachen are eligilbe for an account.

[Atavic]

@mathiasertl No problems for me, only a lack of info that you then kindly provided.

[Atavic]

chinwag.im ChinWag is Australian-hosted: https://chinwag.im/2015/10/08/chinwag-privacy-and-metadata/
chatme.im hosted in Italy.
hot-chilli.net hosted in Germany: https://www.hot-chilli.net/impressum/
neko.im hosted in Holland. Privacy: No more information is collected and stored than what is absolutely necessary. Rosters, vcards, offline messages, and so forth.

[lukateras]

All changes asked in #1688 (comment) are implemented at this point, except OTR deprecation for which there is a more recent issue (#1927). Closing this ticket, if someone wants to propose adding some XMPP server to the list, it would be easier to process if every XMPP server had its own ticket.