PD negotiation issues with Baseus CCGAN10CUS

[kantoniak]

I have a Baseus charger and PD negotiation with Pinecil V2 sometimes works and sometimes doesn't and stays at 5V. I'd like to report it since the charger works perfectly with other hardware that I have and the issue may be connected to IronOS' stack. I've used Pinecil with other chargers (Lenovo laptop charger, MacBook charger) without problems.

I did some testing with PD debug mode (holding the + sign). The hardware:

• Baseus GaN2 Pro Quick Charger CCGAN10CUS (100W) (the charger in question)
• Baseus USB-C cables for Baseus charger (both 2 meters long): 65W (slightly used) and 100W (almost new)

I get different results based on the order I connect things together:

Cable	Connection order	Effect
65W	To outlet, Baseus side, pinecil side	Always works (12 no VBus)
	To outlet, Pinecil side, Baseus side	works about 1/2 of time (12 no Vbus vs 3 no VBus)
	Baseus side, pinecil side, to outlet	works about 1/3 of time (12 no Vbus vs 3 no VBus)
100W	To outlet, Baseus side, pinecil side	works about 1/2 of time (12 no Vbus vs 3 no VBus)
	To outlet, Pinecil side, Baseus side	works about 1/2 of time (12 no Vbus vs 3 no VBus)
	Baseus side, pinecil side, to outlet	works about 1/3 of time (12 no Vbus vs 3 no VBus)

I don't have PD testers which could log details of the negotiation, unfortunately. Can it be Pinecil side issue? Any suggestions on how to improve the reliability of connection?

[Samuelrmlink]

Try this firmware.
Pinecilv2_PPSfix (1).zip

Basically there was a firmware issue that was causing PPS VPDOs that happened to also be the 7th PDO to have a disabled PPStimer - which would result in the charger cutting power to the Iron after about 10-30 seconds. (See PR #1572)

You can use the either the Pinecil updater on Windows or dfu-util on Linux to flash these update files to the device over USB.
Make sure to use the attached files because this fix has not been shipped on the current release of IronOS. (V1.20)

Let me know whether this fixes the issue.

[Samuelrmlink]

What PDOs are listed when you hold down the + button on your Pinecil?
Click through the different PDOs using the + button.

[River-Mochi]

What PDOs are listed when you hold down the + button on your Pinecil?

1. what exact firmware are you running on the pinecil V2? Long hold (-) button.
2. if you could make a short video and drop it in here of you moving through the PD+ menu that wouldl help or just type every PD sceeen you see exactly as it appears. (hold down + before plugging in cable, then hold the + for another 10 seconds, to make sure everything is settled down on negotiation, then use same + to scroll through each PD menu screen).
3. Try to use other cables if possible. also Flip the cable over. not just baseus cables.
4. Since all your other chargers work perfectly fine with the pinecil, and it is only the Baseus charger that is giving issue it would be nice if some PD messages could be captured but you don't currently have a PD tester that can save a log or do PD Analyzer mode.
5. could you post a photo here of the back side of the Baseus charger that is giving trouble- this is side that lists all the specs on it.

I have one charger that is finiky, and sometimes I plug it in and it's 5V, but then I unplug and plug it in again and it's fine so that is what I do with that charger.

[River-Mochi]

Ralim - Samuelrmlink's comment with Pinecil Beta fix is being marked off-topic even though it is relevant - is this some automation bug?
I had to click on it to see it since it's marked "off-topic" ?

[Ralim]

No-one marked it as a offtopic; that is likely an automation from Github because of the double-post.
I believe I've manually marked it to always show now.

[River-Mochi]

I believe I've manually marked it to always show now.

thanks

[kantoniak]

Thank you for the responses. I haven't been able to test latest firmware or get PD analyzer (this may take a while) yet, other info below.

1. what exact firmware are you running on the pinecil V2? Long hold (-) button.

v2.20.14DAF70
13-12-22

2. if you could make a short video and drop it in here of you moving through the PD+ menu that wouldl help or just type every PD sceeen you see exactly as it appears. (hold down + before plugging in cable, then hold the + for another 10 seconds, to make sure everything is settled down on negotiation, then use same + to scroll through each PD menu screen).

PD Debug, only the bottom line changes:

PD Debug
State 12 No VBus
 1  5V  3. 0A
 2  9V  3. 0A
 3 12V  3. 0A
 4 15V  3. 0A
 5 20V  3. 0A
 6  3-21V  60W

When connection doesn't work out, I only get:

PD Debug
State  3 No VBus

3. Try to use other cables if possible. also Flip the cable over. not just baseus cables.

Also tried MacBook charger cable and some unbranded 15-centimeter cable apart from the previous ones, checked all the flip configurations (😄) and it doesn't seem to affect results.

5. could you post a photo here of the back side of the Baseus charger that is giving trouble- this is side that lists all the specs on it.

Image here: Baseus-CCGAN10CUS. Official product page shows other sides.

[River-Mochi]

@kantoniak if you could flash the beta firmware that samuel linked above in the first comment, that would be good to try. you can download it right from inside his comment.

• instructions for updating firmware are on pinecil wiki page here:
  https://wiki.pine64.org/wiki/Pinecil_Firmware

[kantoniak]

Hello, I tried the linked firmware:

v2.20.95C4CAF
24-02-23

PD Debug is exactly the same as before:

PD Debug
State 12 No VBus
 1  5V  3. 0A
 2  9V  3. 0A
 3 12V  3. 0A
 4 15V  3. 0A
 5 20V  3. 0A
 6  3-21V  60W

When connection doesn't work out, I only get:

PD Debug
State  3 No VBus

I'd say that even less negotiations are successfull. I went back to stable firmware for now and I will report back when I get a PD logger.

[River-Mochi]

even less negotiations are successfull.

what did you see when you were in the PD debug, which state lines?

[kantoniak]

PD Debug is exactly the same as before, I've updated the previous comment.

[River-Mochi]

@kantoniak I'm starting to think it's just this one charger you have that is not performing right. since all your other chargers work perfectly fine with Pinecil V2. do you have a PD analyzer like the KM002 or KM003 yet?

you could capture PD analyzer log on your PC which would have better data than the minimal info in PD debug. send logs in in which i've done in past, and perhaps Ralim could look at it since it will tell exactly what is going on.

This happened rarely but on one of my other chargers, sometimes only show as 5V, then I unplug and plug in again and get 20V. those chargers I give away to people or they are in bottom of box. PD analyzer info sent to Ralim is best, but I didn't want to bother at the time since it did work if I just replugged it in.

Specific chargers do cause issues with V2, and it's recommended to not use them. sometimes they are not made to USB-C spec, or for example could be 3 of same model and 2 work and one causes pinecil issues. PD analyzer log might help since it shows exactly the negotiation between the charger and Pinecil.
a good negotiation between a Usb-C charger and the Pinecil will show as State 12 (all is good). State 6 happens if people plug into a QC 3.0 charger (which means it's waiting for comms, which will never happen since it's not PD). I don't know what State 3 is.

see here for some examples of other bad chargers: #1644

[kantoniak]

Thanks for checking in, I just noticed the reply. I do own KM003, but I didn't know it can log PD packets. (I was hoping to sniff out CC lines with a breakout board and an oscilloscope and put that in sigrok or so, but I'm not comfortable with such surgery when connected to mains). Are there any tutorials on how to log PD negotiation? Afaik official KM002/003 docs don't cover Power-Z app.

[River-Mochi]

1. with the KM003, open free software on windows PC, I assume it's same as for the KM002 I have. go to PD Analyzer and record a short session between the pinecil and the Charger. You can download the windows software free from chargerlabs.

2. tbh, I don't know how to use this powerful software fully, I know enough to get the data to send to Ralim and also to get some live charger info. based on following Ralim's instructions ( he is an expert with this software). the user manual from chargerlabs is poor. I wish someone would make a Tutorial on how to use it or write a new written guide to share.

3. Zip the log file, attach it here and ask for Ralim to look since he knows what it means. if you can't get the PD analyzer to work, Ralim is best person to ask since he uses this kind of software all the time. I just know enough steps to give him what he asks for.

4. side USB cable goes from the KM003 to the PC, and one rear cable from the KM003 to the Charger.

5. This video I'm using the KM002 software on the right side of the screen side by side with Joric's BLE chart on the same PC. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7i5oPPaM0K4

6. Photo here, the black cable is going to my charger and Pink cable going to the PC windows for the chargerlabs software.
   

[River-Mochi]

I don't have direct links to the free software so if you can't find it on Chargerlabs website one of the discord pine64 chat members shared link iir.

PD Analyzer you want is the Second screenshot here: #1243 (comment)

Hit the red record button before you plug in the cable to the charger so it gets everything going from the charger to the pinecil and from the Pinecil to the Charger. or basically I hit the record then plug in the black cable to rear of th km002 does same thing.

It's a pretty cool tool when combined with the free PC logger software.

Historical background on how using a consumer device helped Pinecil support.
when the EPR PD3.1 chargers all came out in 2022, most of them would not work with Pinecil. Ralim is in AUS and could not buy any PD3.1 chargers to test except the Apple macbook. The apple worked but none of the other brands people bought in EU/USA.
I and another person had the KM002 software and between us bought several PD3.1 chargers last summer that did not work initially with Pinecil. I imagine the makers only tested them with macbooks since no one knew that Pinecil V2 was 2nd device in world that worked with PD3.1 chargers.

Because of this software/KM002 we could record/send all the PD analyzer logs to Ralim just as if he had the chargers himself. With those logs he found the comm message problem, and adjusted IronOS firmware. in that case it was a matter of interpretation of the USB-IF protocol. protocol said padding of zeros could be ignored, and this worked with apple charger.
However for a bunch of other EPR chargers (all made by same company and rebranded most likely) if Pinecil did not send explicit zeros to chargers, then they ignored pinecil and would reboot repeatedly if we used a 240w EPR cable, but normal PD60 cables were ok. The anker brand had a separate comm issue that was also resolved using the world of volunteers to send logs to Ralim.

[kantoniak]

Thank you for elaborate explanation, I managed to read everything what's needed.

@Ralim I attach two logs for connections which end in State 3 and State 12: pd-logs.zip. Logs have Vendor Defined messages which in my understanding is cable identification. This part was sometimes missing but did not affect whether negotiation is successful. From my testing it looks like Pinecil sometimes does not respond to capability advertising and Baseus repetitively advertises for 10 secs and then stops.

[discip]

@kantoniak
Is your initial issue solved?
If so please close. 😊

[kantoniak]

Thanks for bringing this up. Could someone take a look at the logs please? If it seems to be a faulty device/model, I think the issue can be closed.

I attach two logs for connections which end in State 3 and State 12: pd-logs.zip. Logs have Vendor Defined messages which in my understanding is cable identification. This part was sometimes missing but did not affect whether negotiation is successful. From my testing it looks like Pinecil sometimes does not respond to capability advertising and Baseus repetitively advertises for 10 secs and then stops.

[Neitron4ikus]

I had issues with Baseus PD charger 100W, and with others. After updating Pinecil v2 FW to latest, and changing charger to another cheaper Asometech 65W - it works stable.

[vladimir-poleh]

I have similar problem with Wotobeus 240W charger. Tested with Pinecil V1 and Pinecil V2 and different USB Type-C cables. Both Pinecils are using firmware v2.22E.C308FE8C.

Pinecil V1 is working fine, I have following logs in Fnirsi FNB38 USB tester:

01 03A3 ACC ->
02 0241 CRC <-
03 05A6 RDY ->
04 0441 CRC <-

No available modes are displayed in the FNB38 PD listener UI, just actual 20V.

For Pinecil V2 most of the connections are not working. PD Debug is showing State 3 No VBus, - button returning to the start screen with blinking 496C temperature and 0.0V indication.
Logs from FNB38 for this case are 80 equal records:

01 61A1 CAP ->
02 61A1 CAP ->
  ...
80 61A1 CAP ->

Extended info for there log records:

01/80
0x61A1
0801912C
0002D12C
0003C12C
0004B12C
000641F4
C1A42164

Also I see following modes on the FNB38 screen:

1.  5.00V 3.00A
2.  9.00V 3.00A
3. 12.00V 3.00A
4. 15.00V 3.00A
5. 20.00V 5.00A
6. 3.30-21.00V 5.00A

No modes are selected. PD3.0 105W is displayed in the status area.

If connection of the Pinecil V2 was successful, I have following records in FNB38 logs:

01 61A1 CAP ->
02 61A1 CAP ->
  ...
12 61A1 CAP ->
13 0041 CRC <-
14 1082 REQ <-
15 0121 CRC ->
16 03A3 ACC ->
17 0241 CRC <-
18 05A6 RDY ->
19 0441 CRC <-

Same available modes are displayed as for unsuccessful connections but 5. 20.00V 5.00A is highlighted.
Pinecil is showing correct temperature and 20.02V.