About vitamin system

[game2202018]

We are players which really like your game, and we find the vitamin system is no longer available after some tests and check CDDA browser. So we decide to check github to find out what is happening. After watched your discussion in #50273, we do believed that you think too compliacted for this system. The purpose of this system is force player to find various kinds of food, including meat, vegetable, fruit and so on. Only thing you need to do, is try to make a system look like enough "realism", and the player will try to fix it to reality by imagination. Like meat（VB, IRON）, vegetable（VA）, fruit(VC), that is enough for player. The symptom do not need too complicated, just show some influence or debuff（lower stat etc.） and player will do something, only thing you need to do is make the symptom enough "realism". But the calcium need to be fixed, because there are no too many way to get calcium in game, now you have to drink 4 milk per day to ensure your calcium is enough. We suggest that you can improve calcium of other food, so milk will not be the only way to get calcium. Hope CDDA will be funner in the future.

[game2202018]

PS: also soy bean, rose hip can get enough calcium too, but we think it is still not enough.

[Venera3]

Real things should work like real things work, and real vitamins don't work like that.

[game2202018]

Player need "enough real", not “real”，if you consider about reality, potein show more significant effect to health, more than VB12, the nutrition system of real life is very complicated, you need to simulate it, not make a real one. The realism symptom is good enough and real enough for player, or you have to put too much attention in this issue which is not so significant. Actually if you make this system as you discuss in #50273, we will feel good too. But it feel same from play perspective by a simple system, which cost you less attention and work hours.

[game2202018]

One of my friends want to say:
But vitamins could make ithe game funner. You know people like go city in night because they have night vision so they have visual field advantage，and without enought Va they will lose their advantage. That way make vitamin useful. I remember night blindness worked well in 0.E，that let me grow some carrots naturally. I only understand little .json and I don't even speak English，so I came and tell my feel as a player.

He even can't connect github, so I copy his comment and paste it in here

[SariusSkelrets]

AFAIK most vitamin deficiencies won’t be added since your vitamin levels from before the apocalypse will last for a time too long for the scope of the game

Iron deficiency (from blood loss) is already ingame and there’s plans for a vitamin C deficiency but the player is assumed to start the apocalypse with regular levels in other vitamins, that last for months/years before their levels drop to the point you get symptoms

The players will have time to do all the early game looting they want then chug multivitamins before any deficiency (including vitamin C) kicks in, making the point of limiting the player to make them eat vitamins void as they will live long enough for said deficiencies to be no more than an slight inconvenience when they will start developing symptoms

[actual-nh]

Water-soluble vitamins like not only C but the B vitamins can run out considerably faster. B12 is admittedly rather unpredictable in how fast no consumption will result in deficiency. One reason vitamin C is a likely candidate is that even at subclinical deficiency levels it slows wound healing.

[Venera3]

Scurvy has a relatively well-documented timeline of 1-4 months in healthy adult humans which is what survivors can be assumed to be, and we have real-life examples of overwhelmingly carnivorous hunter-gatherers jumping through a lot of hoops to prevent it. For the rest, there isn't really a set timeline, and for the kinds of symptoms that would have a gameplay impact we're talking years of deficit at the least.

I get the gameplay argument, but to have the impact you describe you'd have to overtune the vitamin system to the point of ridicule, with survivors getting scurvy in a week and your bones turning to dust if you didn't suck on any calcium tablets this month, which is a bit of an issue if we're aiming for realism/versimilitude/not annoying the people in the audience who have an idea of medical stuff.

[kevingranade]

This has been addressed many times. The goal of dda is to present the challenges one would actually encounter in this scenario, not make up new ones, so if satisfying your vitamin requirements are trivial IRL, then they will be trivial or nonexistent in the game.

[game2202018]

Actually, we totally understand what you want to, and we do believe it is good for us too. We only suggest that present a simple vitamin symptoms first, and then you can fixed the symptoms and threhold value by new version, instead of delete most of the deficiency. But we totally understand your decision, if you want to make this by one time, that is great too. We will add the deficiency into vitamin.json to simulate this condition before you fix this problem, thanks for all of your hard working and this game is great and important for us.